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You Come Down Here, P*** In My City...
Don't let Rangers fans rant on about what a shambles the arrangements for the UEFA Cup final in Manchester were. Manchester coped admirably with a Champions League final, the Commonwealth Games and festivities for the 2006 World Cup. The problem was a load of sauced-up fans who didn't have tickets for the game.
I am from Manchester and resent to hell the fact that, just because their team were pants, they go an the rampage and tear up my city. 100,000 people cannot be accommodated comfortably in any city centre, especially when they're boozed-up. It's unfortunate that the screen in Piccadilly Gardens malfunctioned, but considering the arrangements were made at relatively short notice, the authorities coped pretty well. Had any other team made it to the final there would only have been a fraction of the number of the people to deal with anyway. I think that, until Rangers got through to the final, there weren't any plans to erect big screens in the city at all.
I understand the herding instinct, though really, wouldn't it have been better to stay at home, get together with friends and watch the game on big screen tellies at home/in the pub? Manchester wouldn't have the rivers of p*ss and vomit to clean up this morning if they had.
Anyone who watched Rangers progress in the competition can only have done so with amazement. How can a team that played so badly get so far? The fact that they scored the lowest-ever number of goals in getting to the final says it all. Can the fans really be surprised that they lost? Thank god a footballing team won.
Disenchanted Mancunian
Blaming Manchester City Council
Let me start by saying I live in Manchester and so have a clear view of the aftermath of the 'party' from last night - and it is ugly. However, I cannot pretend to be surprised and I presume no one else from GMP, Manchester City Council, local residents, Rangers' fans, football fans, etc, is surprised either. People will talk about how football fans should be able to act in a civilised manner and that it is a minority...blah, blah, blah but as soon as Manchester City Council declared the city open to any Rangers fan who chose to travel and invited them to a party in the city the result was inevitable. Rather than simply say that they would provide facilities for small numbers of ticketless fans they said that the whole of Glasgow was welcome. Talk of a party ramped up the 'exuberance' to fever pitch, people wanted to be there (understandably) and the rest followed. When you serve alcohol from 10AM on a warm summer's day it surely can't be a surprise that the party turns sour. Also, talk of good-natured celebrations during the day aren't borne out by my experience and my friends experiences of seats and bins being thrown through shop windows from 2PM and fans running through the shops and streets intimidating shoppers and workers. Still - it was worth £20 million to the local economy and we will have an inquiry so that is alright...
K Champion (Manchester)
On The Lovely Tartan Army...
After the scenes in Manchester last night, does that mean we can see an end to all those emails from the Jocks saying how they're better than the English cos when they go abroad they just enjoy themselves, there's no trouble and everyone thinks they're great.
Dave, London
...Yet again English fans prove they can't travel without getting drunk and causing mayhem wherever they go. Why is it that Scottish fans are so much better behaved? Oh, hang on...
R Hill
Memo to the People of Manchester
We here in Aberdeen would like to apologise wholeheartedly for failing you yesterday, for indeed, it was our duty to warn you, that Rangers fans are indeed the scum of the earth. Stabbings, riots, trashed city centres: sadly, this kind of behaviour is the norm for our Rangers supporting cousins. Aptly, the European Kings of Winning Without Scoring were taught a footballing lesson last night, which serves as compensation in a sense to us all, having endured watching a brand of football which makes Chelsea look like Brazil, but again, I reiterate our apologies, though I'm glad the whole world will now see and agree, that these people should be kept in a cage, cordoned off in Govan, as we, Aberdonians, have motioned all along.
Iain 'Rangers will Lose the Title at Pittodrie' Grant
...Once again last night, Glasgow Rangers fans showed themselves up. Disgraceful behaviour in Manchester City centre and outside the ground, leaving a multitude of injured people, police and devastation to the public in their wake. Now don't kid yourselves like BBC did last night, and talk it down. This was disgusting, on the second biggest stage in European club football and in full view of the watching European and World of football fans. One Russian man lies wounded in hospital after being stabbed. Ridiculous.
I know they may have their grievances with the large screen TVs not working, but Manchester is a big city and is more than capable of housing that amount of football fans in the various pubs. In Seville 03, Celtic fans encountered the same issue when large screen TVs set up in a car park were not working. Instead of fighting with the police, everyone marched towards the city and crammed themselves into any bar they could find to catch the game; there were a group of four locals playing backgammon on the table behind us with no interest in the game funnily enough.
Afterwards, the fans got awards for their excellent behaviour. Just ask Barcelona and Villarreal how they feel about Rangers fans, and they will tell you the same thing. As the flag at the Old Firm Derby recently put it quite brilliantly, they are in fact 'Scotland's Shame'.
On a very sad note, we must bid farewell to a great player, manager, coach and an absolute gentleman in Tommy Burns who passed away this morning. Tragic at only 51, which once again makes all else around it pale into insignificance. RIP Tommy.
Karl 'we're after the SPL title now' Byrne
Those Rangers Tactics In Full
Rangers' tactics were based on Alan Latchley's Escapini Defence, which consisted of a ten-man defensive unit. Walter Smith had 'em stood on each others' shoulders in the goalmouth with their backs to Zenit, relying on rebounds.
D Macintosh
More Importantly...
Anyone else hoping that the Zenit player from last night, Andrei Arshavin, plays in the Premiership next season so we can hear more hilarious mispronunciations of his name?
Dermot, Tipperary
Here We Go...
Now that the Championship Play-Off line-up has been decided I'm counting down the days to what will undoubtably be an amazing occasion. The result of that one game will decide how Bristol and Hull City fans enjoy their season next year. For one team a year of excitement, thrilling football and glory awaits. And for the other...a straightforward relegation from the Premiership.
Patrick Jordon (so obvious a joke I'm almost sorry) London
...Congratulations to Bristol City and Hull City for making it through to the playoff finals...is it too early to bet on the team to finish last in the Premiership next year?
Dave Coote
Why I Will Be Watching Greece v Russia
Yes, I will be watching. And I am glad it will be on Saturday evening replacing such classic programming as 'Ant & Dec's latest saturday night borefest' or the BBC's 'Dancing whilst skating on Andrew Lloyd Webber'.
Anthony Bunnage 'even a dull footy game is better than the crap on the TV on a Saturday these days' Cheltenham
...Just want to agree with Oliver from yesterday afternoon's mailbox. I'm looking forward to the European Championships too, and will watch every game. I reserve the right to abandon Austria vs Poland if its crap, but I'll certainly give it a go and hope for the best. I'm disappointed Ireland aren't there, and if Scotland or England had made it through I'd have shouted for them, but just because they aren't there doesn't mean I won't watch it and it won't be a good tournament.
England's games in the last World Cup were hardly classics so I think there's a good chance the tournament will still be enjoyable. The group of France, Italy, Holland and Romania is soo tight every match is crucial and it could produce some absolute gems.
Pretty much every group has some potentially good or great games, like the games between Portugal, the Czechs and Turkey in Group 1. Hell even the Swiss, a very boring team to watch, may be good as they're the host nation, and traditionally in tournaments the host nations games always have an extra bit of spice
Group 2 looks about the worst of the lot, with Austria, Poland, Croatia and Germany, but it still throws up a couple of good ones with the Germans against Croatia and Poland.
Group 3 is the big one, and already mentioned, but then Group 4 has the holders Greece, who topped their qualifying group I think, and Spain, Sweden and Russia. Again a lot of potential for good, competitive games.
So in short, dont be so blinkered to think that because the home nations aren't involved it wont be a good tournament for the nuetral to watch. If anything we'll all be spared the disappointment of glorious failure and the endless what ifs, and we can instead relax and enjoy the football.
Birdy, Ireland
...Regarding Oliver Dziggel's recent mail regarding Euro 2008, I am happy to say that I will be among the minority (if Mediawatch is to be believed) of football fans actually quite looking forward to Euro 2008 in spite of the lack of home nation participation. The suggestion that ITV and the BBC are somehow about to fall into a ratings abyss because England aren't going to be there is quite disconcerting. Considering that the Premiership is touted as the most exciting and best league in the world it is quite amazing that there should be such an apparent lack of interest in the Euro's from the fans here.
As far as I'm concerned, football is football. I love watching England as much as anyone else, but not just because it's England. I follow England because it galvanises my community, particularly when it comes to the big tournaments. People come together and share something, and there's pretty much nothing else I can think of that does that. And while I'll miss the banter and the atmosphere, I'll also be free to actually enjoy the matches from a neutral stand point. The African Cup of Nations was one of the most goal-rich and exciting competitions I can remember. It was made all the more captivating by the touch of mystery which my neutrality gave it. I know hardly anything about African football, but it was exhilarating to learn.
In short, I love football, and a month or so of almost constant coverage of an international tournament sounds like the basis for a perfect summer. Yes it's sad that the home nations aren't there, but to assume that no-one is going to be interested in the tournament as a whole because of that is, frankly, embarrassing. I'll watch any game, because I love football; it's not a part time thing for me and I know there are more of us out there who'll watch any game, any time, not because of our club and country loyalties, but purely because its football. Its just as simple as that.
John Doak, Reading
Switching Allegiances...
In response to Kris Garthwaite, I can perfectly understand why his mate has switched from Man Utd to the Toon. It's the same reason we all pick teams like Brentford and Wycombe in Football Manager and try to get them promoted. It's more interesting. I personally wouldn't be very interested in supporting a team that was expected to win every match, score a hatful of goals and win a couple of trophies every year. Good job as a fellow Toon fan. I can take a perverse pleasure in striving against adversity. If anything the Toon have done to well of late for me and I almost switched off after they started putting a run together. I Live in west London and my son's a Fulham fan (I brainwashed him to pick any London club but Arsenal or Chelsea but was kind of disappointed he didn't pick Brentford) and I take him to a lot of games. I've so enjoyed their season this year and was toying with buying us season tickets next year - although their survival has kind of put me off. So while I'm not exactly switching allegiances as I enjoy it more when Fulham lose, I can see your friend's point.
Jimmy the Fish
...Kris Garthwaite is right to be p***ed off with his fickle friend. One night in a bar two absolute stunners sat at the table next to me and my buddy. We had been on the raz for quite some time, so filled with artificial confidence I went over to their table. They were sisters, they were hot, and you could just sense they were dirty. It went quite well, and soon all four of us were sitting and drinking together. After a little while, without anything being said, it was clear to me and my buddy that I wanted the brunette, and he wanted the blonde. We ended up back at my friend's apartment, myself and him unable to believe our luck. After a while the blonde asked if there was a bed she could sleep in, and the two of them dissappeared. Everything was falling into place. But then my buddy reappeared. The blonde really did want the bed - she was tired, and the sly b***ard quickly turned his attention to the brunette. This p***ed me off no end, I had been putting in the hard yards all night, and to lose her in the home straight just wouldn't be right.
Thinking I was being amazingly subtle, as if talking in some indeciferable code, I asked him "what happens when you're a kid and you chose what team you're going to support - can you ever change it?". He knew the answer and sulked off (I wouldn't have for him). Everything worked out, and although she was super hot, she wasn't that great at...well...stuff. It didn't matter though, I was great. Turned out her boyfriend was in prison, and I was warned to avoid a couple of places, which I duly did. But the fact remains, when you chose your team, you simply can't turn your back on them just because another team are going to shag you - or something like that.
Joe Donohoe
...In response to Kris Garthwaite, I also have a mate who stopped following Man Yoo when it became dangerously unfashionable to do so (around about 2000) and started supporting Bristol City - the team from the town he grew up in. Now I don't mind this as such, and I have gone on the record in the past as saying that more people should do this - especially if they have kids to take, but the man in question now lives 200 miles away from Bristol and, as far as I'm aware, has attended one game in the last eight years.
The thing is, I'm a Premiership team season ticket holder, but I've been to more City games than that in most seasons since then and it strikes me as a bit ridiculous to say the least to go from 'not supporting' one team from miles away to 'not supporting' another team from equally far away. This is all the more irritating as I will be watching the play-off final with him and there is still a bit a lingering antagonism over the fact that he once told me that I wasn't allowed to follow City as well as my main team and I responded with a four-letter tirade topped off with the word 'hypocrite'.
At least your mate actually watches 'his' team and made the decision to dump ManYoo of his own accord and not because all his university mates took the p*** out of him for being a gloryhunter.
Rockin' Robin
...I have a mate who supported Man United from when we were growing up in the early/mid-90s until he decided he wanted a change of scenery in 2005 and United had gone a couple of years without a title. Who did he decide to support? Chelsea.
Personally I don't have a problem with people who support 'big' teams from other parts of the country because I'd prefer to watch a team that plays football that I enjoy watching rather than the local rubbish because of some parochial mindset (maybe it would have some weight if players were actually from the area in which the team is based), but choosing to watch Chelsea every week? It's hard not to laugh now, especially as he becomes increasingly defensive when pressed on it. His excuse used to be that he was a fan of Mourinho, but he's still sticking with it. Pride as much as anything, I think.
Even so, at least choosing to support Chelsea at that time could be explained with the term 'glory hunting'. Can't say the same for picking Newcastle.
Olly
...In response to Kris Garthwaite, Darlington, after the treble my brother switched from Man United to, guess who, Newcastle. The fact is your football club is in your blood. My brother never stopped following United and quickly realised he could only ever be a Manchester United fan.
Cian Shine, MUFC
...In response to Kris Garthwaite's e-mail about fans switching clubs, I'm afraid I'm one of the nutters in question, having swapped Man U for Middlesbrough at a reasonably young age. And yes, I was sick of supporting a team that was winning everything. There's plenty of other reasons for the swap though.
For a start, the only reason I ever supported Man U in the first place is because I was told to by my dad. That's also the only real reason anybody I went to school with supported them too, seeing how the local side were, and are, abysmal, and their stadium is a toilet (Luton, if you're asking). Anyone who's in their early 20s is probably going to remember what school was like back then for a football fan - Man U fans gloating about winning all the time, anybody who doesn't support Man U calling them glory hunters. Friendships were lost, ribs were broken, kids were suspended, it was the best of times, it was the worst of times, and so on. Eventually I got to an age where I just wondered why I actually gave a s**t. By the age of 13, I'd stopped watching football altogether because I couldn't be bothered with all the pointless bickering that came with the territory. That was the season of the treble win - it was also the same year that two people living on the estate next to mine were stabbed for wearing Man U shirts.
It was only really when I started college that I began paying attention to football again, mostly because I'd begun to discover that not knowing anything about football meant that I couldn't really hold a conversation with new people when I met them - I didn't know who Nwankwo Kanu and Jermaine Jenas were, and they didn't know who Opeth and Dead Prez were, so there wasn't much middle ground. I tried being a neutral, but the problems with that are obvious - people saying you're not a real fan or accusing you of being a Man U/Arsenal fan who won't admit to it, games not really meaning that much to you, and so on. By the time I'd really begun caring what was happening I'd become a Middlesbrough fan. That just happened for a few reasons - my parents met and got married there, Bryan Robson represented a familiar face for me from my Man U days, I'd always been a big fan of Juninho and he'd just rejoined the club, and so on. But really, a big part of that was the fact that people don't instantly dismiss someone when they find out that they support Middlesbrough, the way they do with Man U fans.
People who've known for a decent amount of time still take the p*** out of the fact that I swapped teams, but the honest fact is that I never cared enough about Man U to put with the insults, the violence, and pettiness that I had to endure. You could say I got bullied into not supporting, but really it's just as true that I got bullied into liking them in the first place. At heart I'm a fan of football, first and foremost - I want to watch and enjoy the sport, not walk around acting like I'm superior to everyone else because my team won or because I support a 'real football team' (whatever that means). Being a Middlesbrough fan, particularly one living this far south, means I can just get on with that. Being a Man U fan absolutely destroyed any joy I ever got out of it. I've got no idea whether any of that is true for your mate too, but since he went to Uni fairly recently I'm guessing his age isn't too far away from mine, and I reckon if you showed this to him he'd recognise himself in parts of it.
I will say this much: sticking 8 goals past Man City meant just as much to me than any of the medals Man U won while I supported them. I still hope they win the Champions League though.
Nick Butler
...Until the mid-eighties, my sister was a massive Liverpool fan and religiously got the Kenny Dalglish Annual every year. Then Graeme Sharp, Adrian Heath and co came along and started winning stuff, and she became a Toffee overnight. She had posters of them and Duran Duran all over her walls, and no amount of Paul Walsh pictured shirtless in the Daily Star would make her leave the Death Star.
Still, I always remember her puffy striking face when Ian Rush rammed the third goal past them in the '86 Cup Final. She has been taking lessons in bitterness ever since.
Chris (only in Liverpool does toffee taste bitter) Moore
...Kris Garthwaite, Darlington, hit on something that I have been trying but failing to embaress my oldest mate over, for years. When we were about 6 or 7, we were both Liverpool fans, growing up in the North West at a time when LFC were the best team in the world.
Then when we were about 13 or 14, Gazza was playing for Spurs, and hey presto, my mate turned into a 'Toppenham Hotspur' (sic) fan for two seasons.
He then went on to support Scotland for a season, before finally turning his attentions to Manchester United just in time to see them lift the Premiership title.
His cousin, who grew up in a very blue-orientated Manchester household, also followed suit and switched allegiance from City to United in the same season.
The worst part of all this though is that neither of them see what they have done as the slightest bit out of order - they both think that as they were kids, they should have been allowed to support who they wanted, only making the final decision when the weight of success swung in another direction.
It's sickening.
Caesar (Hand me that rope after all, I'll say goodnight) Mondragon
...I went to school with a kid who supported Spurs, he was from a Spurs-supporting family and went fairly often to see them. By the time we were leaving school he was somehow fanatical about Chelsea. Not sure how or why this change happened but it did. I thought nothing of this and lost contact with him over the years. Imagine my surprise at an add on facebook and then seeing that he has grown into something pretty hideous. Yup celebrating Man U winning the league like he was instrumental in it.
Spurs to Chelsea to Man U. Could it get any worse?
Lee, Slough
Some Tw*t Action In Front Of Footballer...
Yes, yes I have made a tool of myself in front of a footballer. It was when Stig-Inge Bjornebye and Vegard Heggem played for Liverpool. I bumped into them one time and grabbed Vegard by the hand and started shaking away. I didn't say anything mind. After a tortuous 30 seconds of hand pumping I realised both of them were looking at each other as if to say, "What a dickhead". I felt like shaky hand man...that bloke who used to see how long he could shake peoples' hands for. The end result is, I let go, turned and briskly walked away as if nothing unusual had happened. Not a word passed between us for the whole thing. I'm still embarrassed about it now.
Don't get me onto the Louise Redknapp incident!
Guy, Liverpool
...I once saw Garry Speed in Newcastle and being in shock to see the midfield legend, I stuck my tongue out and gave him a double thumbs up, I felt like complete f***wit afterwards. To his credit, he just smiled back, he probably thought I had a learning disability or something.
Paul Harte, Newcastle
...A friend of mine once bumped into Dean Saunders in a pub in Bradford. Despite Deano being clearly unhappy with the attention, my mate enthusiastically went to shake his hand and tell him how much he appreciated his efforts for the Bantams. As he did so, he realised that Dean had only half-heartedly stuck out his hand and my mate had been vigorously shaking his index finger. Dean looked at him with the expression 'Tw*t' written all over his face and my mate trudged away red as a beatroot.
Adam Stokes
...True story. In 1983, my mum, by then well into her fifties, returned home from Heathrow airport, telling of how she had gotten autographs from two footballers 'from that team you like' (which was/is/always will be Liverpool). She described them as both having moustaches, which didn't really narrow it down. And then...there it was, out of her coat pocket, she produced an envelope with the names Ian Rush and Bruce Grobbelaar written on the back. IAN RUSH and BRUCE GROBBELAAR!!! 'They were very obliging', she said, 'Once I had told them that my son was a big Man Utd fan.' Still, thank f**k Wayne Rooney wasn't around in those days.
Noel, Cork
...In reply to Cliff Mallinder's enquiry (Ever made a t**t of yourself in front of a footballer) - yes indeedy, as a teenaged Wimbledon fan I once all but bumped into Efan Ekoku in Epsom high street and blurted out to my girlfriend alongside, very much too loudly, 'that's my hero!'. He pretended not to hear...
Around the same time I was at a charity cricket match featuring the Dons players, drunkenly approaching Neil Sullivan on the field of play to ask him 'have you got any money for a beer?'. He was kind enough to point out the fact he was in cricket whites, and therefore unburdened by change, when the back of his hand may have been a more fitting response...
Andy (AFC now, since you ask) Woodward, Streatham
...On the subject of Cliff Mallinder's 'times you wish you'd shut up upon seeing a footballer', I am quite prone to this ailment. I saw Keith Gillespie and Maik Taylor in a Belfast nightclub last year after a Northern Ireland qualifying match which I'd attended that afternoon (it was a Saturday) and I was a little worse for wear. I asked Gillespie what he thought of Bryan Robson as a manager. He said "He's sh*t." So far, so uncontroversial. I then reminded Keith how we went to primary school together and I still have an athletics team photograph of us both in it, and he was sporting the greatest pudding bowl haircut I'd ever witnessed. Cue stony silence. Not taking the hint, I plopped myself down at their table, turned my attention to Maik Taylor and promptly spilt his partner's drink all over him. I mumbled my apologies and sloped off.
A few years ago, I bumped into Sammy McIlroy, looking rather beleaguered, enjoying a meal with his wife shortly after NI football team had just passed 1000 minutes without scoring a goal. I marched over, once again slightly merry, and announced I thought he was doing a good job in difficult circumstances. Both he and his wife thanked me wholeheartedly so, rather than resting on my laurels, I pressed on and told him I had spoken to Terry Neill (the ex-Arsenal manager) a few days previously and Terry wanted Sammy to give him a call for some advice. To say Sammy and Terry don't see eye to eye is an understatement. My reception immediately grew frosty.
Finally, I was speaking to Gerry Armstrong at a Snow Patrol concert and pointed out he had a BO problem. Tonne of bricks. Down like.
Simon (suffering from Foot in Mouth Disease since 1976), Belfast
...In response to Cliff Malinder's email about embarrassing moments with footballers - I saw my favourite player Ian Wright in a pub once and duly went over to ask for a photo. He said "I like your t-shirt, where did you get it?" which made me panic so I said "you can have it". He just laughed and said "it wouldn't fit" and walked off. Embarrassing.
Ed, North London
...I once saw Andrew Cole in Manchester city centre come out of a Porsche. As I was a huge fan of his from his Man Utd days, I ran up to him and said 'Alright Andy (realising I had made a mistake)..err... Andrew... I'm your biggest fan, I loved your song!'. To which he replied while looking around street and making no eye contact with me, 'Thats nice to know...you know where the parking meter is?'. To which I replied 'Yeah, don't worry about it put your money away, I'll get it for you.' He then looked directly at me replied 'you're alright' and then shook his head, making it quite clear he thought I was a total prick.
Hassan Maan (Huge Andy, I mean Andrew Cole fan)
And Some Of Both...
Being a multi-functional mailboxer I have produced an email to answer the questions put forward by both Kris Garthwaite, Darlington and Cliff Mallinder:
Firstly in response to Kris Garthwaite, you are definitely not alone. My best friend at school used to support United (sorry, MANCHESTER United), just like me, until one day he decided it wasn't for him and took up the arduous and soul-destroying task of following Southampton. Nobody batted an eyelid and rightly so, he was commended for his 'failure hunting' and general bravery and duly went about his business of getting a season ticket and becoming a loyal supporter. The years went by uneventfully; there was never any real rivalry, because, you know, by then Saints were rubbish. This continued until the final day of the dramatic 04/05 season. Saints had us at home, and I had a ticket for the away end. Foolishly, I asked my mate for a lift to the ground, I didn't really want to see them get relegated, and we had nothing to play for so I wasn't expecting us to send them down. However we ended up beating them 2-1, quite needlessly may I add, promising the most awkward drive home I have ever experienced. To make matters worse in an effort to break the silence, I stupidly said 'I bet you wish you hadn't changed teams now, eh?'. Unimpressed is the polite way to describe his reaction.
Anyway, I digress. In response to Cliff Malinder, I have most definitely made a fool out of myself in front of a footballer. A couple of seasons ago at Anfield, Rio Ferdinand (whilst injured) had sneaked himself into the away section, so at the end of the game I thought I might as well get an autograph etc. I went over, asked for his signature, dropped the pen trying to give it to him, knocked into him when picking it up, then started to shake his hand when he reached for the pen the second time, yes I know, I'm a tw*t! On another occasion I was walking to my seat at O.T and Rooney (he was injured) walked past me and a friend, I was quite taken a back, but my mate simply came out with "alright Wayne" in the most nonchalant manner you can imagine, it was hilarious, even Rooney smiled!
My Southampton-supporting friend saw Ian Holloway in Loughborough the other week and decided he wanted an autograph (he was smug from surviving the drop in place of Leicester). He had the intention of answering the question of "who shall I make this out to" with the answer: "League 1". Harsh, but very funny. However he felt bad and bottled it at the last minute. Probably a good decision, I think he would have gotten a smack if he had said that to Holloway!
Joe (Still being blamed for all of Saints' problems) Norton, Manchester
