Wilshere over Ozil? Spurs a feeder club? Berbatov a flop?

Date published: Friday 29th September 2017 12:35

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The return of Super Jack
Kneejerk reaction:

I was going to write a mail about the entire Arsenal performance but I think I will reserve the whole thing for the return of Super Jack.

The boy looks back. Almost everything he touched oozed class and he gives something so few other players offer, particularly English. I know it’s ‘only BATE’ but a seasoned Champions and Europe League team could surely give most bottom half Prem teams a decent run for their money. An assist and a wrongly disallowed goal, his influence dropped in the second half as we did our best to do a Classic Arsenal.

He has always been a hero of mine. We are the same age and I remember watching him coming through the ranks and eventually breaking through and wondering what I was doing so wrong with my own life. This is why last season at Bournemouth was so perplexing. I’ve given it a lot of thought, and I think the issue is that even though Eddie Howe has instilled an impressive brand of football, they do not play anything like Arsenal and the players are nowhere near the same standard. I don’t think that’s debatable. He needs a team with lots of possession, and players around him who he can trust to make highly intelligent runs, and find him with their own quick passes and flicks. Plus, being made of glass and having a poor temperament is an awful recipe, almost always exploited by teams fouling him all game. He needs someone to put an arm round him and love him. Arsene does that.

Keep slowly bringing him back game by game, next giving him some minutes in a league match, and I really think (if, IF, IF) he stays fit (I know, I know) then he is a starter. It’s easy to forget this Arsenal team has been without arguably 2 of its best players in him and Santi for so long. Other than City with Kompany (and arguably Gundogan) I can’t think of another challenging team with anything similar. With all the negativity around Sanchez and Ozil, I can’t imagine Jack on the back of a comeback season turning his nose up at a new contract and pissing off to pastures new.

If he plays at anything like he did tonight and manages the rest of the season, show me a better CM for Englands World Cup.

(Cue long term injury/ ban for on field scuffle/ being caught with a cheeky cig)
Oli, Bermondsey

 

I know it was only BATE (are they any worse than Apoel?), but are there any Arsenal fans out there who would rather see Ozil play for us than Wilshere?

No, I didn’t think so.
Adonis Stevenson, AFC

 

Jack Wilshere looks old as dirt.
The Flan, North London

 

Oli, Oli, Oli
Oliver Giroud.  100 goals in 238 appearances. Man city home and away, Man United home and away, Liverpool home and away, Bayern home and away. Goals against Tottenham and Chelsea. Hattrick in a must win away Champions League game. Scored in an FA Cup final and set up two cup wining goals.  Bang Average
S.Singh

 

No excuses, Arsene
While watching our game against BATE (EUROPA LEAGUE), it got me thinking that Arsene should not even make excuses this season.. we have B team for Europa league(Chambers to replace Mostafi) and we have a very good squad for the league and a good bench to support, this means no excuse none whatsoever.

Manchester United did it last season and most of the first team players where also picked up for the competition. what wenger need to do, is to keep giving young players a chance and players who comes from injuries to gain fitness, by the time we reach second round sometimes next year, we should know where we are in log standing, if by end January 2018, we still with a chance of pushinh for league title and have no major injuries, wenger will have to make a choice and decide if he goes for the league( only if we ha e a real good chance) or he does what Mou did and just focus on UEL to gain entry to UCL.

I hopr he keeps the balance and the rotation as it is, i just fear that we might get BAYERN on our group in UEL, seeing that they got smached yesterday.

I can only hope wenger we get few new players in January if we are still in it on both the league and the UEL.

As for our defence, i just dont know if Steve Bold is influencing and mastering the defence or its just players, forget the instructions.
Lwazi, Cape Town

 

Feeder club Spurs?
Ah, the Chelsea fan crawls out of the woodwork to take out his obsession with Spurs.

Let’s be honest Darren, our rivals are the Woolwich not you.

But anyway by your standards what does that make Chelsea? Discounting the fact that for most of their existence Chelsea have had footballers that most decent clubs wouldn’t want and the fact I don’t really know too much about them anyway, didn’t we take one of your own in Cundy from you as well as Durie? Didn’t Villa take Townsend off you, didn’t Dorigo move from Chelsea to Leeds?

Even after you got taken over by old Roman and your status has been artificially inflated, didn’t Robben move to Real Madrid, Matic went off to United, Costa decided he wanted to goto Atletico, that’s just three…I could probably find more if I tried. To be fair I know you’re scraping the bottom of the barrel when you start talking about Mullersy to Fulham and Jennings being forced out to Arsenal but yeah great a total of 16 players over a span of forty years counts as a feeder club.

On your other list there’s plenty I could put as joined Spurs when there were interest from other clubs, Gazza, Ardilles, Rebrov(although he was rubbish), Bale…even if the interest from United was to be believed this season Aurier.  Going back even further didn’t greaves join us from AC Milan after rejecting interest from Chelsea( oops I forgot you wee talking about bigger clubs not those bailed out by oligarchs)

Here’s a news flash Darren: footballers move, it doesn’t make anyone a feeder club

Anyway Darren stop bothering about Us, yes we have to do things slightly differently, relying on spending what we earn, improving our income by building a new stadium and relying on the loyalty of a long suffering but sizeable fan base. Of course that’s all alien to Chelsea but horses for courses but perhaps you should take your own advice and stay in your box and concentrate on cementing your status as London’s fourth most supported Club
Raj THFC North London

 

OK I’ll bite Dazza, CFC.

First can I say if you can only find 17 transfers over a 47 year period as examples then you really are clutching at straws to prove your argument. I could probably prove that a lot of clubs have been feeder clubs over the same period including CFC if I could be bothered to check.

But let’s look at the list of supposed Tottenham transfers as a feeder club in detail shall we. I’d class a feeder transfer as player bought for some money sold to a bigger club for a lot more money after 1 or 2 seasons.

 

70’s
Alan Mullery to Fulham – 30 Years old so Sold back to Fulham who were the feeder club to us in the first place. Not a feeder transfer, just a transfer of an older player.

Pat Jennings to Arsenal – At 32 Years old Spurs thought he was at the end of his career and sold him, how wrong we were. Not a feeder Transfer just a bad decision.

 

80’s
Steve Archibald to Barcelona – This one could be classed as a feeder transfer but at that time it was just a transfer. Spurs were offered good money (1.5 Mil in 1984) so they sold him.

Alan Brazil to MUFC – Was at Spurs for one season and 10 games. He hardly set the world alight for Spurs or MUFC. Not a feeder just a transfer between clubs. A bad one for MUFC as it turns out!

Richard Gough to Rangers – Wanted to move back to Scotland and he went to Rangers!!!!! Defiantly not a feeder transfer.

Waddle to Marseille – Not really a feeder transfer, just a transfer. Waddle wanted to play in the European Cup, something no English club could offer at the time, Spurs got good money for a 29 year old so they sold him.

 

90’s
Gazza to Lazio – Yep I’ll give you this one. One of the big European teams came calling and we sold to them.

Paul Stewart to Liverpool – Just a Transfer really. He wasn’t a great striker ended up playing in midfield and was a flop at Liverpool. Not a feeder Transfer by a long way!

Sherringham to MUFC – At 31 Years old Sheringham was getting to the end of his career and wanted a shot at winning something so the club let him leave. Could be classed as a feeder transfer but not really as the player was 31 at the time.

Popescu to Barcelona – At the club for 1 season he didn’t fit in so was sold for about the same money as we paid so not a feeder transfer.

 

00’s
Campbell to Arsenal – WTF, really a feeder transfer. He left on a free Spurs had no say what happened!

Carrick to MUFC – Yep I’ll give you this one. One of the big teams came calling and we sold to them.

Berbatov to MUFC – Yep I’ll give you this one but he threw his toy’s out of the pram and at this time we couldn’t say no to the money. I suspect it might be different now.

Modric to Real Madrid – Yep I’ll give you this one. One of the big European teams came calling and we sold to them.

Bale to Real Madrid – Yep I’ll give you this one. One of the big European teams came calling and we sold to them.

Walker to MCFC – Nope I’m not having this one as we didn’t sell because we had to. Poch said OK he can go but only for silly money plus are City a bigger club than spurs at the moment. They have more money yes but bigger that’s debatable.

So out of 17 transfers listed only 5/6 could be classed as feeder transfers, hardly makes us a feeder club.
Fenspur (If it wasn’t for the Russian’s money CFC would be a feeder club so back in your own box) 

 

Excellent wind up from Dazza, CFC to try and claim that Alan Mullery was poached by Fulham.  For anyone interested in, you know, actual facts and history and that, I can recommend The Glory Game by Hunter Davies, which gives an excellent account of Mullery’s struggles to get in the first team and his resultant disaffection.  The whole book is a fascinating insight into the inner workings of a team, the man management of Bill Nicholson and how things have changed.

What is undeniable is that a club that was regularly one of the big spenders from the 50s up to the 90s has had to change its approach over the last 20 years through a combination of poor management (probably the major reason) and circumstance (which hasn’t helped) plus the skewing of the market by smaller clubs with les history being financially doped from abroad.

It’s been a chastening period (the later 90s and early 2000s were particularly depressing) but the vast majority of Spurs fans are absolutely delighted to be supporting a club on the up with the prospect of the city’s biggest club stadium to watch them in next season.

Cheers
Adam Jones

 

Obviously I know the best thing to do is ignore a troll, but I couldn’t resist responding to Dazza’s hilariously selective email on stepping stones at Spurs.

Whether it was ignoring world class signings across the decades like Greaves (who had used Chelsea as a stepping stone by the way), Peters, Ardiles, Gazza or Klinsmann, or including Alan Mullery (sold well after his peak), Jennings (mistakenly sold early after 13 years at the club) or Popescu (a flop at Spurs), the lack of objectivity really was a treat.  Most priceless of all of course was that it came from a Chelsea fan, who didn’t sell world class players for much of the period in question because they didn’t have any whilst languishing in the second tier.  Must try harder if you’re going to try to get a real rise out of Spurs fans
Phil

 

I’m not going to bite on Dazza, CFC. I’m certainly not going to subject pre-money Chelsea to any similar analysis.

When I look at players that leave spurs, my concern isn’t “we’re a feeder club”.. I see the herds of players that get relegated the second we sell them- the Huddlestones, Livermores, Routledgeses etc.

In my eyes- better to be a feeder club than a club that evidently needs to shed players who aren’t good enough. (And it really pains me to say that about Huddleston, loved the guy).

Nature of the beast, we don’t have the same wage structures, we don’t compete to pull the same players. Nice to be in the mix anyway..
Dan

 

Palace to start a managerial revolution
In a jangly-keys-to-children style attempt to distract from Klopp/Liverpool..

I’m not sure why this came into my head, but a quick glance at Crystal Palace’s results shows that after four Games, De Boer had 0 points, 0 goals scored and 7 goals conceded. Roy Hodgson has managed to achieve that exact same record in only three games. If they fail to score against United at the weekend and United score, does that mean Uncle Roy gets the chop too? His 4-game record would be worse than De Boer’s after all, it would only be fair.

If so, I would like to see Simon Jordan adopt a ‘guest manager’ policy for the remainder of the season, in a similar vein to when Simon Amstell left Never Mind The Buzzcocks and they just got the current flavour of the month in to present rather than replace him permanently. Surprisingly, Buzzcocks wasn’t actually that bad and some episodes were really good (particularly the Rizzle Kicks one, where they made Fun Lovin’ Criminals’ Huey Morgan walk off) so why wouldn’t it work for Palace? They could have a different manager pretty much every month! Ancelotti’s diary is free, incidentally, and maybe Xabi Alonso could have a trial run too…

Hell, they may even survive the drop with guest managers, and what a story that would be! Even greater than ‘doing a Leicester’ i’d say!

Make it happen, SJ.
Lee (sending hugs to Ed and Ant), LFC

 

Big Weekend‘s little brother
Bournemouth-Leicester City. Okay, it’s starting to get serious. The Cherries are next-to-last in expected goals and almost that bad in actual goals. They have to find a way to create chances. Junior Stanislas looked fit against Everton, and they’ll need him to stay so. This is heresy, but Benik Afobé runs the channels better than Jermain Defoe, and perhaps can create more space. That might be the way to go against Leicester, who play a narrow back four. As for the Foxes, it’s almost as serious. After a brutal early schedule, they now have a run of winnable fixtures, and need to prove themselves sooner rather than later. Andy King and Matty James have both been disappointing alongside Wilfred Ndidi, and so there’s not enough protection for the back four. At left-back Christian Fuchs might come back in for Ben Chilwell, who has been erratic in his two starts. Will Demarai Gray get a chance in attack?

Stat: Bournemouth have had a higher percentage of their shots blocked than any team in the league, 37.0%.

Stoke City-Southampton. You don’t have to wear red and white striped pajamas to know this is an important match. Both sides have top-half ambitions, neither has looked consistently assured, and both have had great difficulty finding the net. (They were even blanked by Championship clubs in the League Cup.) City’s schedule hasn’t been particularly kind, but they have yet to maintain a fluid attack. The Saints had lots of possession against United, but rarely looked like scoring, and the same was true against Swansea and Watford. Manolo Gabbiadini has dropped off the cliff after his impressive start, and if the Potters have a reliable scorer he’s hiding pretty well. Shane Long was at his best last week, and might get the start against a crippled Stoke back line. Mark Hughes may be down to one healthy centre-half, Kurt Zouma, and has to hope Geoff Cameron will be available.

Stat: Stoke already have more assists via through ball this season (1) than they had all last year (0).

West Bromwich Albion-Watford. The Hornets won at Swansea last week, but with Nathaniel Chalobah missing the Swans dominated midfield for long stretches of the game. He’s out long term, so Marco Silva has to choose between Etienne Capoue and Tom Cleverley in that spot. If it’s Cleverley, Roberto Pereyra might play the number 10 role, a good idea against a difficult Albion defence. The Baggies played their best and unluckiest game of the year against Arsenal on Monday night, and Tony Pulis now has a choice: stay with the 3-5-2 or return to four at the back for more protection against Richarlison on the wing? Grzegorz Krychowiak is starting to show his quality and looks like a top signing, if only as a loan. Talking strikers, Jay Rodriguez did everything but score against the Gunners, and André Gray broke his duck at Swansea. Dare we hope for a few goals?

Stat: West Brom have made the fewest passes in the league, more than 200 fewer than next-lowest Newcastle, and more than 2200 fewer than leaders Manchester City.
Peter G, Pennsylvania, USA

 

Don’t forget the Toon
As a self-appointed Newcastle Utd promoter on the F365 mailbox I have to take issue with the Top 10 Champs Lge performances by English clubs on foreign soil (bloody hell that’s unexpectedly long to say) as there is a glaring omission.

I know it may be easy to forget that the Magpies have graced the Champions League but we have, twice. Which should have been thrice if we didn’t lose a ridiculous penalty shoot-out at home to Partizan bloody Belgrade in 2003.

On a cold night in Rotterdam in November 2002, Newcastle headed over to play Feyenoord in the last game of the opening group stage with an outside, but very unlikely, chance of squeezing through to the second group stage. Two group stages back then. crazy times.

What was needed was for us to beat Feyenoord and for Juventus to do something they hadn’t done for genuinely donkey’s years and win an away game in the Champions League. Now take into account Juve were already through and headed over to the freezing cold of Kiev with only the motivation of winning the group.

Plus Dynamo were a decent team back then and needed a victory to gain qualification themselves. It was expected that Juve would throw the towel in. Now also take into account that NUFC lost their opening 3 fixtures and it seemed were out of their depth at this level. The victory over Juve at home (told you they never won away) was seen as a nice highlight of a harsh campaign.

Newcastle got off to a flying start and lead 1-0 at halftime. Then amazingly Hugo Viana doubled Newcastle’s lead, yea that’s right, Hugo Viana. This really did happen, Google it. Then the news came through that Juventus were winning. What? How? Why, even?

Feyenoord struck back. Jon Champion was on commentary duty that night and screamed, “Oh be careful Newcastle”. Typically, we weren’t. Feyenoord scored again. We had blown a two-goal lead. But there was still something left to play for heading into the last minutes. We were sitting third in the group and dropping into the UEFA Cup, not too bad.

The news came through that Juve won and we were praying we could hold on in injury time to gain the UEFA Cup pla….hang on, Kieron Dyer is through, he’s in…..oh the keeper saved, you useless piece of sh…BELLAMY!!!!! It’s in!!

I screamed and I jumped. Jon Champion screamed again, “Has there ever been a more dramatic night in the Champions League?!”. Istanbul hadn’t happened yet and Mr Champion had forgotten about 1999 in the Nou Camp but I didn’t care. The final whistle blew. Sir Bobby was delighted. He attempted his little merry jig but remembered he had broken ribs that night.

We had actually done it.

We had qualified for the second phase of the Champions League after losing our opening three games. This record still stands today. It really was quite ridiculous.

In the second group stage, we went on to win in Leverkusen (2002 finalists) without Shearer and Bellamy and with Shola Ameobi and Lomana Lua-Lua up front, seriously Google that as well, plus we took the lead twice at the San Siro against Inter, leaving with a 2-2 draw.

But this night in Rotterdam was special. I will never forget it as long as I live and it’s important others don’t also. In fact, if you have never heard of it until now then I am glad I have brought it to your attention.

Hope this get’s published now as I should have been taking the dog out before it rains but did this instead.
@ToonBano

 

Berbaflop
Demiflop Berbaflop. Gregory Whitehead is quite the wordsmith. Bad wordplay aside, describing Berbatov’s time at United  as a ‘hideous failure’ is incredibly harsh. Robbie Keane was a hideous failure. Di Maria was a hideous failure. Berbatov is not in this category, not even close.

Did Berbatov fall short of his expectations? Yes he did. I expected more of him at United and his body language didn’t help when things weren’t going his way but Berba was as languid on form as he was when off it. He was one of my favourite players to watch when on song and he had some delightful performances. For a hideous failure he won the golden boot and premier league in the same season including, as I am sure Gregory will remember, a hattrick against his beloved Liverpool. And what a beautiful hat trick it was.

Hideous failure? Nah.
Dave, Ireland

 

Berbatov won the premier league golden boot, 2 league titles and scored a wonderful hat trick v Liverpool.

If that’s a hideous failure, then I would like Mr Whitehead to explain what his lofty standard of success is?
Shidaan (South Africa)

 

Think that was Storey. Obviously
I understand Bernard (avoiding tabloids since I found this site) MUFC’s yearning for a stripped down version of the gossip section, it does get somewhat wearisome reading about the same transfer rumours over and over again (I still have nightmares about Hulk moving to Chelsea or Sneijder signing for United) but the beauty of the gossip column is the way it serves up steaming piles of dogplop with the contempt it so rightly deserves.

All transfer gossip is essentially either an agent/player agitating for a move/pay rise, mindlessly repackaged dross designed to garner clicks or, worst of all, whatever those lovely souls over at the Daily Star sports desk picked out of the hat that morning – the ONLY way to serves this sh*te and make it palatable is with a wink and a nod.

I don’t know who wrote it but I distinctly remember laughing out loud reading something along the lines of “grab a basket and come on down ’cause it’s pick your own bullsh*t day'”. I’ve tried to work that into everyday parlance countless times and not once have I regretted the awkward silence that’s followed.

Christ, I’m already looking forward to the fecal delights in store tomorrow!
Simon (Mediawatch however, I can’t get on board with) CFC

 

Puns
Just a quick note:

There have been some excellent puns on F365 over the years, so please don’t take the following as an admonishment, but more a gentle nudge back in the right direction.  The usage of ‘Delph’ in two puns today has bothered me- ‘Clean bill of Delph’, and ‘in rude Delph’.  Not only are they punning on the same word, which is acceptable only if the pun is genuinely innovative, but ‘Delph’ does not even rhyme with ‘health’.  This shoehorning is doubly shameful given the options available that do so- ‘All by myDelph’ springs immediately to mind, for example.  This brings me onto my next point: pun headlines that you wish existed.  I’ve long hoped that Wifried Bony and Kevin Prince Boateng would get caught in some sort of cocaine-related nonsense, purely to facilitate the headline ‘Bony Prince Charlie’, whilst if Leicester’s Slimani could see fit to produce some heretofore unimagined piece of skill to win a game, we’d be in a position witness the controversial but puntastic headline’ Radical Islam’.  Just a thought.
Ben, London (Three-o Walcott)

 

Listen to Graham
Websites rely on clicks to generate revenue.

It make sense United would be the club anyone would cover because quite frankly they have more fans than Chelsea.

Also as F365 pointed out anyone running a website prizes original material over other content and the site has a limited headcount to serve the punters.

Never mind you’re getting all this lovely content for free. You’re a reader not a customer so shut the hell up.
Graham Simons, Gooner, Norf London

Also, Chelsea topped our Champions League winners and losers column. Which you should read, as it happens.

 

What a guy
On the bus to school this morning, my son said “Whenever I’m not sure how many days there are in a year, I just remember Football365 and then I  know.” Classic!
Paul in Brussels 

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