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Both penalties WERE correct
Before we get into the salty Liverpool tears…can we please caveat every email on the subject by stating the decisions for both penalties were correct?
The first one, Lovren had ample time to control and clear the ball, instead of falling over like a drunk and shanking it. I get that the rule is a bit shaky, but if Lovren did his job by simply clearing the ball upfield, danger would’ve been adverted and play would’ve continued. In this case, his clearance was shinned, so the play will continue. And there’s no way Kane dived, he was clearly clipped by Karius. The second one, you just can’t kick someone from behind without it being a foul.
Fair play to the officials for making the right calls in hostile territory.
Great game, great goals, great calamity moments and drama up until the last kick…football eh!?!?
…Re Liverpool v Spurs
The officials got every major decision correct
John (Neves makes my tummy funny) Collins WWFC, London
Here are the salty Liverpool tears…
I can’t believe Spurs got a penalty awarded for Lamela’s play-acting yesterday. Lamela went down so theatrically at first I thought he’d been taken out by a sniper in the crowd. But my point is this – he engineered the penalty. VVD’s leg was well on its path to trying to connect with the ball – the ball – and then along comes Erik and throws his body between that leg and the arriving ball with predictable results. How can this be a penalty? Lamela is not interested in the ball; the cheat just sees his opportunity to dishonestly gain advantage. Fair play to the ref who satisfied himself there was nothing in it. He applied his common sense to the situation. Unfortunately the linesman (or whatever he’s called these days) loses the plot and, despite having an inferior view compared to the referee, decides he wants his moment in the sun. To cap this off I then see two ex-Reds Danny Murphy and Mark Lawrenson endorse the penalty decision and say that Lamela was ‘very clever’ in getting the penalty awarded. How can this be ‘very clever’? It’s low-down and it’s despicable. Lamela is not the only practitioner and Reds players too have been guilty in the past. But this increasingly childish pantomime of diving in the game needs to be addressed and so-called experts like Murphy and Lawrenson need to cop on to themselves and see things as they actually are.
Kieran O’Hare (LFC, Dublin)
…Congratulations to Alli, Kane and Lamela for completing a triad of disgraceful dives, not one of which was discussed by Sky Sports.
Congratulations to the linesman who was seen fist pumping at full time…for some reason.
Congratulations to John Moss for saying he had no idea what happened with Kane so he was giving a penalty anyway.
Genuinely the standard of refereeing this season has been atrocious. Watford away, they score in the last minute and it’s offside – two points down. Everton at home, DCL throws himself into Lovren – two points down. Spurs now get two penalties via two offsides and two dives and we’re two points down again.
Come on Arsenal.
Paul M (Genuine congratulations to Wanyama for the goal of the season right there) LFC
…Normally I try and take a fairly reasoned approach to mails but what the **** was that?
Two massive dives for the penalties and one of them was offside as well. Tottenham are one of the worst sides in the league for diving – the referee should be penalising them not bloody rewarding it.
I understand there is some difference of opinion across the board on these but there is no way in hell, however you look at it, that *both* of those were pens.
Tottenham probably were good value for the draw but I really don’t care.
Thank God for Mo Salah.
This is why we need VAR
Given the amount of time it took for the penalty decisions in Liverpool vs Spurs, better the referee use VAR for such important decisions as opposed consulting the linesman based on what he saw. Or consult someone with access to a replay system (much like how he’s consulting the linesman).
Again I personally don’t advocate using VAR for every small little thing is that would slow down things too much (and it won’t solve everything) but some decisions in a game can be fairly big and referees are already allowed to take their time on it and consult. So I think we should give them the tools to help them as much as possible in these situations.
I’m not even saying the officials necessarily did a bad job in the penalty decisions without VAR’s help all things considered (so this isn’t a “they screwed up, VAR would have gotten it right” mail). I just feel like if we can give them more tools to help them to assist them in situations like this this, we should.
That lads, is why we need VAR. Also since universally everyone agrees that diving is a little shit, why not introduce a 5/6 game ban if you are given a yellow card for diving more than twice in a season. It can of course be reviewed after the game that the yellow card was deserved or not.
A Reasonable LFC Fan, India
It’s largely irrelevant
You can argue until you are red in the face about whether either of the penalties should’ve stood but even as a Liverpool supporter I don’t believe we would’ve scored our second had Kane not missed the first penalty, the miss gave us and the crowd the lift to finally start fighting. Also, Spurs played us off the park in the second half and had we won it would not have been deserved.
Chelsea 1-1, Everton 1-1, Arsenal 3-3 and now Spurs 2-2. Only Liverpool can achieve an expected and perfectly acceptable result, in a way so frustrating that it would feel worse than a defeat after full time. Only Liverpool.
Credit for Tottenham please
I listened to 606 last night and the regular moans about the lack of love for Spurs in the media. This was only days after my Arsenal supporting ‘friend’ described us as media favourites. I try to take a phlegmatic view of these things, but the coverage of the last two matches has shone a light on something. In two truly excellent Spurs performances, the narrative has been about how poor Manchester United were and how the officials changed the game on Sunday. Even Matt Stead in his 16 conclusions focussed on the Liverpool team and tactics and penalty decisions – then had the nerve to finish on a note complaining about us focusing on officiating!
The best aspect to me of yesterday’s coverage was Dermot Gallagher explaining, on Sky, exactly why both penalties were correctly awarded – still, doesn’t fit the storyline when we can use phrases like, ‘deemed a penalty’ (that was the BBC) and ‘convoluted offside laws’ (no sh!t). To the point though, they are the laws of the game and are written down and available before kick off(although not read by many pundits/journalists/players…).
Spurs v Liverpool was an awesome game, spoiled afterwards by a focus on the ‘incidents’ to generate clicks and coverage. All three teams contributed, with the officials making fewer mistakes than both Liverpool or Spurs. Surely we should be talking about Victor and Mo?
Rob (Spurs, but you probably guessed that)
Liverpool are the Sex Pistols
This will upset the Klopp fanboys but he’s a fraud.
They genuinely play football like a juiced-up non league side.
Two big geezers at the back who can barely move .
A workmanlike midfield who just run around like headless chickens and kick everyone.
Boot it up in the air every other touch of the ball. At times it looked like they were genuinely trying to beat each other with who could hoof it the highest/furthest.
Smash it down the channels for the obligatory fast forward to chase down.
I’ll be utterly ashamed to finish below that shower of shit.
If that’s rock ‘n’ roll football it’s the Sex Pistols. Full of energy for a short period of time but ultimately all mouth and no trousers, with a spiteful temperament and a sense of entitlement.
Utterly terrible football considering how much money they spend.
And their fans…f**king hell, I’ve not heard anything like it. They go on and on like Samuel L Jackson in A Time To Kill (c) @DanLouw, every time something as small as a throw in is given against them.
Ross H THFC
What. A. Match.
The only people with the right to feel aggrieved about the outcome would be the officials, who made several calls that were spot on (off the top of my head Davies’ tackle, Alexander-Arnold’s tackle, Alli’s dive and both penalties) and still seem to be getting flak in some quarters. Salah’s second goal may have been offside but, even as a Spurs fan, it seemed too close to call in real time. Advantage to the attacking team, right?
Dier will probably escape censure for his clumsy backpass freeing Salah to score the opener as it happened so early in a remarkable contest. It was a poor piece of judgment from a player in one of the game’s key positions, but he did improve as the match went on.
When I saw the teams I thought that Liverpool’s midfield seemed stodgy and unlikely to create much. What I neglected to consider was how much energy Milner, Henderson and Can could provide, and Liverpool had near complete control of the opening half. Spurs simply weren’t allowed to settle, and Alli in particular was confined to the periphery.
Second half, though, was like someone had flipped a switch. Liverool seemed to have run out of steam after their efforts in the first half, allowing Spurs to swarm though the Liverpool half with impunity. Only some determined defensive work from their backline kept us out. Well, that, and Alli’s irritating flop. He does go down easily in the box, I doubt any Spurs fan would argue, and on this occasion he anticipated a challenge that didn’t come and was rightly booked.
Lamela for Sanchez was a brilliant substitution for Spurs. Sanchez had an Anfield debut to forget, but by the time he was taken ff he was surplus to requirements as Liverpool sat back. Lamela provided the industry and extra attacking outlet to stretch the Liverpool defence. He’s still recovering from a horrendous injury, but the sight of him buzzing around and unsettling a defence is one of my favourites as a Spurs fan.
Victor Wanyama, my word.
Yes, it was a contentious match. Yes, there’s an awful lot to talk about. Yes, both sides have grievances that will doubtless be aired ad nauseam over the next few days…but when a match is played like this one and features two goals like Wanyama’s and Salah’s second, it serves as a reminder of just how good football can be. What. A. Match.
…Boy, that game was something.
Can’t we just have Poch and Klopp manage all of Top 6?
Ram (Jose were you watching?), New York
Time to go, Jack…
This may sound like sacrilege but I’m going to say it.
I think it may be time to move Jack Wilshere on.
He was quite clearly the biggest loser from our scintillating display at the weekend as he lost his place to Rambo. He’s gone from future Arsenal captain and mainstay to bench warmer in just one game.
The reason I think his time is up is his productivity. Jack just doesn’t score or create enough to warrant a place in the team. There’s an argument to drop Xhaka but I don’t think he should be in the team either.
This has been the year Arsenal have been ruthless in a way I’ve not seen before. I could imagine Arsene clinging onto Walcott, while Gazidis told him ‘come on now – you’ve got to let him go now’ and it will be the same with Wilshere.
It was only one game but I haven’t seen an Arsenal team play like that since Pires and Henry were at the club. We can’t afford to carry anyone in this Brave New Arsenal – not even Jack.
Graham Simons, Gooner, Norf London
Ed’s weekend thoughts
* Listening to Crystal Palace versus Newcastle United, it felt like one of those games that wouldn’t have a long highlights package, but was actually quite enjoyable to listen to. Both teams had chances to win the game, but neither ultimately did.
* Palace are far more effective with Wilfried Zaha out wide, rather than as a second striker. There is a logic to getting him running at centre-backs rather than full-backs, but his best performances tend to be when he starts wide and threatens to move inside.
* The penalty was soft, but because it went my team’s way, it was the correct decision. Actually, because Ciaran Clark was pulling Christian Benteke’s shirt, it was the correct decision. For all of Rafa Benitez’s complaints, there was a clearer shirt-pull later on that went unpunished.
If this site ever did a topical top ten of the ultimately insignificant but still irritating comments made during post-match discussions, “if they were consistent they’d have to give ten penalties in every game” would certainly be in there.
* There is always a danger that a former player among the opposition will come back to haunt you, especially one on a goal drought, given Palace’s propensity for helping teams and players break their unwanted streaks. However, Dwight Gayle barely got a sniff yesterday, as the defence were by and large (switching off for the goal aside) well-marshalled.
* Such is the messed-up nature of the Premier League, the Eagles are 14th and one of four teams on 27 points, and yet they’re only three points clear of the relegation zone. However, that gap – and particularly avoiding defeat against two of their rivals – was especially important given that after the game against Everton, they face Hotspur, Manchester United and Chelsea in succession. Fully expecting them to be in the bottom three by then. Once those games are out of the way, they’ve only got Liverpool of the very top teams, so the majority of their games will be against the other teams in the relegation mix. It’ll be a case of waiting to see who blinks at the wrong time.
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