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Get a f***ing grip, Liverpool fans
Hello F365, long time reader, first time writer.
As with many, the mailbox this morning grinds my gears. What is it with Liverpool fans?
Today, we have Dazza, LFC, Dublin complaining about Klopp and his failure (so far) to sign a left-back. Most Liverpool fans (me included) would love him to sign one, but who knows, perhaps Klopp is not able to get a left-back of the standard he requires? Perhaps he likes the look of Gomez and plans to give him his chance? Perhaps he wants to give Flanagan a chance to play there when he hopefully regains his form and fitness? Perhaps the best left-backs do not want to join a Liverpool team currently without European football, and let’s be honest, not particularly competitive in league terms of late?
Dazza also goes on about how much money we have made this transfer window. So what? Are you suggesting that Liverpool have not had a successful transfer window because they have made a surplus? And Liverpool are already looking like a one-man team? Pack it in. In my opinion Klopp has improved the first-team squad and trimmed some (most) of the dead wood. You do know that we have played three (F*CKING THREE) league games? With half a new team? And all away from home?
We also have Oliver Bayley who tells us what a rubbish job Klopp is doing and, surprise surprise, backs this up with stats. Perhaps Rodgers’ stats are better than Klopp’s because Rodgers had one wonderful (perfect storm) season where he could regularly rely on the brilliance of Sterling, Sturridge and Suarez? Backed up by an ageing, but still pretty good Gerrard. Rodgers then bought predominantly £85m worth of crap and dropped it into Klopp’s lap.
And I don’t recall Oliver complaining too much about Liverpool beating Chelsea 3-1 at the Bridge, Man City 4-1 at the Etihad (and 3-0 at Anfield) and Everton 4-0 at Anfield. Oliver also fails to mention them beating Manchester United 2-0 in the last 16 of the UEFA Cup, followed by impressive victories over Villarreal and Dortmund. Or the two cup finals Liverpool reached.
Last week (maybe) we had other mailboxers writing in saying how sh1t Liverpool were. Where is the sense of perspective here? Ten months ago almost all Liverpool fans were delighted to have secured the services of Klopp, three (F*CKING THREE) league games into the season and they’re coming out with all this whining sh*t.
I don’t like to be the bearer of bad news, but perhaps you haven’t noticed that Manchester City, Chelsea, Arsenal and United have been far more competitive than Liverpool in recent years? They can offer regular Champions League football and have bucket loads of cash? Liverpool haven’t won the league for 26 years or whatever.
Liverpool have been pretty average for a long, long time with a sprinkling of success here and there. Klopp needs to be given more time to build a squad, not all this negative crap after three league games. I’ve followed the club for longer than I care to mention and I would be absolutely delighted if we became competitive again, or who knows, maybe even win the thing (next year is our year?!) sometime soon. But get real, Liverpool are not the huge lure they once were and it will take time to get back to that lofty position. Certainly longer than three (F*CKING THREE) league games. Get a grip will you and start supporting your team.
…The modern-day supporter is a thing of ‘beauty (vomit)’. It takes all of five seconds for them to fall in love and then out of love with a player, manager, life partner whatever. I mean having to listen to endless and mindless arguments of some against JK just defies belief. They tend to ‘forget’ (I use that word lightly, as they never actually knew) that JK success at Dortmund did not take one season. In fact, he took a club meandering in no mans land (sound familiar) from sixth to fifth to successive titles! This clearly indicates a ‘bedding in’ period. He not only tries to build ‘his’ team but tries to change the way players may be use to playing the game by instilling some tough expectations on them (case in point Sakho and Sturridge…. Adapt or die). Some succeed while others fail but all this takes TIME.
Which brings me to some of the mails I managed to get through in this edition of the mailbox (it was painful reading). Oliver Bayley’s piece was exceptional, thought provoking stuff (?). I mean how else could you describe the illogical nature of comparing Rodgers’ stats with that of Klopp. I am pretty sure one of them were managing Liverpool for a longer period right? Oh and the other small fact that JK came into a new league with an inherited squad from his predecessor but we will ignore that fact. My fellow supporter the stats (however meaningful you actually think those stats are given the small sample pool) may not reflect a change in ‘immediate’ results but the way the team is playing is night and day apart (no illusions needed). Again, stop looking at short’term gain and neglecting the long-term success which will come.
I could babble on forever but I have to continue the painful process of allowing social media to irritate the living cr@p out of me by everyone and sundry being opinionated:
ConwayT17 (If you give the man time then it’s time for you to leave) LFC, Sydney
…I’m a Liverpool fan. An embarrassed Liverpool fan. It would seem that people like Oliver Bayley have very short memories. Rodgers got plenty of time (two and a half seasons) before the fans starting losing patience with him, and even then it was more to do with his ‘outstanding’ approach to things and failure to follow up Suarez’s season with something equally exciting. After another season of that and the opportunity of signing one of the most charismatic and best managers about, the board took the plunge.
Klopp hasn’t even had a full season yet, and all the while there are fans losing patience. I tell you what, let’s sack Klopp because he’s not won the league by September and try and get a better manager. And exactly who out there is a better fit or option?
In the first five matches of Rodgers’ first season they’d lost to West Brom (3-0), Arsenal (0-2) and United (1-2). That season they also exited both the League Cup and the FA Cup in the 4th Round, while dropping out of Europe very early indeed to the mighty Zenit SP. That season, Liverpool under Rodgers had a win ratio of about 46%. During the season they had ‘excellent’ results against Oldham, Hearts, Young Boys, Stoke, Villa, etc… Within his first season, Klopp made it to two finals and has only just started to build a new team. There have been glimpses of greatness amid moments of very disappointing results.
What were you expecting Oliver? A new manager to come in and win 90% of matches, without conceding and scoring three or four every match? Personally, I’m still very happy with Klopp and excited that he’ll be our manager for three or four more years at least. I suggest supporting Chelsea if you want to get impatient about your manager not winning every match.
…How many more Liverpool supporters are going to keep writing into the mailbox moaning about Klopp?! It is embarrassing frankly. He’s been in the job 10 months. 10. Months. One of the reasons everyone was so excited that we got him after Rodgers was sacked was because he turned Dortmund from also rans into a swashbuckling football power house. It’s been noted repeatedly that this transition did not happen overnight and that Klopps first two full seasons ended in 5th and 6th place finishes. We were fine with that. We were excited that we had managed to pull in an A-List manager with a record of success, that given the time and support needed, had every chance of doing something similar with Liverpool. Give him all the time he needs was what we all said. Rome wasn’t built in a day.
Yet now, 10 months on, there are daily mailbox entries from fans moaning about him. The other day someone wrote in complaining about the things he says in press conferences (remember when you loved about him that about two months ago?) Now today there’s not enough pressure on him?…. B*llocks!! There’s f*cking loads of pressure on him because Liverpool fans are everywhere and the desperation to win the title again is greater than at any other club in England. And he f*cking knows that as well. People genuinely seem to expect him to be perfect? I really have no idea what these people expect perfect to be. Not winning absolutely every game is treated as though it’s a disaster. Get a grip for crying out loud! How about, and I know this seems radical in 2016, just supporting him, and the team and letting him get on with it and giving him those two or three years he clearly needs to turn around a club that has under achieved for the past 20 years (barring the odd miracle of Istanbul type thing).
He’s not perfect. No manager will be and they all have blind spots. Every Liverpool fan wants a new left back and possible a DM. Doesn’t look like we’re getting them. Get over it and stop pretending you know better. Just let him get on with it and if after three years of no discernible progress, and not after 10 months, come back and moan then.
Rick, LFC, Brighton (Wanting to give managers actual time since, forever)
Rodgers’ record is boosted by Suarez
In his last season as LFC manager Rodgers lost to, among others: Villa, West Ham, Newcastle, Palace, Hull, Palace again and Stoke (6-1!). We drew at home to Sunderland, Hull, Everton and ostrich-era Leicester and were tonked twice by LVG’s soporific Utd team. Outside of the league, we embarrassed ourselves in the CL, taking five points from a group containing Basel and Ludogorets, and dropped into – and then straight out of – the EL. We contrived to lose to Sherwood’s Villa in the FA Cup semi-final after scraping by a series of lower-league opponents, needing replays against two of them.
Without the artificial boost from a performance-enhancing Uruguayan, Rodgers’ stats are no better than Klopp’s. Admittedly this does show that things are yet to really take off under JK but the reasons for optimism are found outside of the numbers. There are no longer factions between coach and players, or coach and board. Players are signed because they fit with the manager’s gameplan, rather than as part of the bizarre ‘one for you, one for me’ agreement Rodgers and the infamous transfer committee found themselves in. The players seem to love playing for the manager, instead of merely putting up with his weirdness. Essentially, for the first time in years, we have a squad, coaching staff and board that all seem united under a common objective.
In one Europa League run, Klopp has already delivered big occasions that would have been well beyond a Suarez-less Rodgers. It may be taking longer to find that elusive consistency than many had expected, but you won’t find many LFC supporters that don’t feel we’re moving in the right direction.
JG LFC (Plus it’s always nice to have a manager that doesn’t treat the fans like idiots, as I’m sure Everton fans will agree)
…What Oliver is trying to do, from what I understand, is ask for a balanced opinion on Klopps tenure so far. I agree to this point but completely disagree when he picks out stats which I believe are comparing Rodgers win % over three years to Klopp’s one. Either you compare Rodgers first year to Klopp’s or his last with same number of games but even then it’s not fair. As this window is Klopp’s first major attempt to sort things out whereas Rodgers after three summers or so messed up big time.
However, this is not even the point. Liverpool under Klopp are a lot more watchable. There is a direction, a plan and a strategy which is not only attractive to watch but can be seen on telly. With Brendan he moved from possession obsession to counter-attacking (worked a treat) and then suddenly to nothing. Games were hard to watch, we won games we didn’t deserve to win and lost which we thoroughly deserved to lose. It’s exactly the opposite in Klopp’s case.
Lastly let’s not forget the number of games we had last season and the focus on Europe towards the end which impacted our league perforamance over the last two months. When making a comparison, the last thing one should do is pick one set of stats (not even consistent there) and make a final judgement based on that. He hasn’t succeeded yet and may fail along the way (everyone does) but as long as the matches are exciting and we can see a gradual improvement and a direction where we are heading, I am more than happy – which I am right now
Khurram Alvi, Islamabad – (Jurgen sign a Left back for heavens sake you idiot)
Of course we give more leeway to lovely Klopp
In response to Oliver Bayley, that’s how life works.
For starters, to see how much progress is being made under Klopp you would need to take Rodgers’ first 10 months at Liverpool and compare it to Klopp’s first 10 months. Or more importantly Rodgers’ last 10 months and do the comparison.
In both respects he’s ahead of Rodgers in win percentages but more importantly he’s not a f***ing muppet.
I cringed every time Rodgers opened his mouth, at least under Klopp it’s entertaining in the right way.
That’s how life is. When you like someone they get a little mroe leeway, you look the other way at times because you are fond of them. When you dislike someone then you are more critical of them.
In every walk of life the person who’s nice and affable, gets on with everyone, doesn’t rub too many people up the wrong way will get more of a buffer zone, will get a few more free passes than the idiot who people think is alright but could do with shutting up because he makes an fool of himself. The person that seems OK, but isn’t really likeble all that much.
Eventually they get on your nerves and every little thing starts to grate on your nerves and you pick faults where before they might have gotten a pass. It’s not fair, but it’s human nature.
Why would football and the fans be any different to every other walk of life?
Sadio likes the sunshine
The consensus from Liverpool fans seems to be that Mané is the bright spark at Liverpool so far with the team relying on him for attacking threat. Just a word of warning…Sadio doesn’t like the winter very much and whilst at Saints his form tended to drop off dramatically Nov-Feb.
He may only be one for the summer and the spring but I miss that Wanchopean ball of unpredictability.
Jon Tucker, Southampton
Can we have Gnabry back if he’s good?
If Ivan Gazidis has sold Serge Gnabry to Werder Bremen without inserting an intelligent buy-back clause (otherwise known as the De Bruyne manoeuvre) I will use my set of specific skills to track him down and loudly, yet politely state my displeasure.
I genuinely think in two years time he’ll be incredible. Looking forward to Wenger insisting he knew he was a talent when he signs for Bayern for £30m and runs German football with Kingsley Coman for the next 10 years
Tom, (Anyone else noticed just how one-footed Lucas Perez is?) West Hampstead
Alas, news has just broken that Henry and Bergkamp will not be playing at the game this weekend. However, George can console himself with seeing five players from the Milan team that gave Cruyff’s Barca dream team an almighty tonking in 1994 (seven if you count Simone and Carbone who were on the bench), plus Costacurta, Vieri and Cafu.
I shall be there reliving the days when Milan had a jaw-droppingly great team, I could watch Gazzetta on Saturday mornings whilst doing my homework marvelling at how fabulous everything looked in James Richardson’s world (especially the ice cream) and the most pressing worry in my life was trying to remember the main bits of the Treaty of Versailles for my History GCSE. Happy days. Still can’t quite believe that it’s three sleeps until I see Paolo Maldini, unless George’s bad luck is catching.
Keira, ITFC, That London
…Well, this is…awkward.
Step 1: Arsenal cannily promote a ‘Legends’ game using the iconic partnership of Bergkamp and Henry.
Step 2: Tickets sold out in anticipation of a finite opportunity to see these two masters perform.
Step 3: Henry and Bergkamp’s appearance cancelled in the days leading up to the game; Pascal Cygan steps in.
Step 4: Another nail in the bond between the club and its supporters.
Really, Arsenal? Really? Whether from sheer incompetence or (I hope not) mercantile cynicism, this leaves an awfully poor taste in the mouth.
All the way from New Zealand to see Grimandi and Cygan. Poor George – and worst of all: no one seems to have told him.
In reply to Paddy, Ireland – Definitely the best football weekend I had was in Hamburg for my brother’s stag party.
We went to a St.Pauli game. They play in the second division of the Bundesliga but I can honestly say it’s one of the best atmospheres I’ve experienced at a match. Flares, constant chants and an away section that was genuinely intimidating. Also, guys sell bottles of German beer outside the ground for a Euro from a shopping trolley. Tickets were 30 Euro.
Nightlife is great – check out Reeperbahn. It has everything you’d want for a lads weekend (EVERYTHING!). Pretty cheap too and great transport network. I’d recommend it to anyone.
Paddy (ruling out Italy because that country is damn expensive) Ireland, is asking for suggestions on where to go for a footballing weekender.
The only answer, for me Clive, is Cologne. Whilst not the most beautiful city in Germany, it is a drinking man’s heaven, the local beer Koelsch, is very cheap but only served in 0.2 or 0.3l size glasses, so you can knock back plenty before you know where you are. There are so many pubs it’s hard to list them but head to the Friesenplatz part of town on the Belgian Quarter and take your pick.
As for the football, apart from Cologne themselves, you have Leverkusen a quick train journey away as well as Monchengladbach for a Bundesliga fix. Even Dortmund and Gelsenkirchen (Schalke) are easily reachable by train (do not stay in Dortmund, it is easily the worst city in Germany that I have visited).
The good thing with Germany is as every game is shown live in the first and second division, if you pick the right weekend you can even take in a 2. Bundesliga game too – from Cologne, Bochum and Dusseldorf are close by or if you want to slum it in the 3rd Division, Duisburg is close too. Alternatively, depending on the time your main game kicks off, just sit in a pub and watch the Konferenz. All Saturday afternoon games shown live on the same channel. One main game, whilst rotating to the other games as something interesting happens.
Can’t be beat for a football weekend in my opinion.
Paul (Auf geht’s Eintracht), Germany
Just to add a third point, how does Neil Ashton get away with considering Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain a central midfielder…?
Granted, he played 90m in central midfield against Sunderland as recently as, ahem, January – 90m of a total of 269m in his whole professional career though.
Is Degs a fictional character?
Do your esteemed writers take it in turns to act the part of a degenerate, alcoholic gambler in the same way as they do with 16 Conclusions, or the new, and quite brilliant, Weekly Awards?
It is the only possible conclusion I can draw from being told on a Friday that the Red Devils are ‘absolute banker’, yet being told on a Wednesday by – supposedly – the same person that they ‘needed Hull City to hold on against Manchester United having backed the draw at 13/5’.
I remember an irate punter in the bookies complaining that a – TO reMain naMelss due tO libel laws – tipster would nap five different horses in a five horse race across five different media outlets and then lap up the praise. You have done your character a disservice this week by doing quite the opposite. To borrow from Mediawatch – just talk to each other!
NAPster, Belfast (getting bankers beaten since ’01)