Mason Greenwood saga was an omnishambles and Man Utd deserve no credit
The Mailbox after the Mason Greenwood announcement is here and Man Utd are given no credit from most.
We also have mails on Liverpool, Arsenal and Brighton. Read them and maybe this and then send your mails to theeditor@football365.com
Man Utd arrived at right decision in the wrong way
Well I’m pleased that United have finally made the right decision on Greenwood and it’s proof that the world (or UK anyway) is changing for the better in respect of this issue. Footballers quite literally punched their girlfriends in public 25 years ago and continued their playing careers. The public weren’t having it this time.
However, United need no patting on the back for this. I don’t mind the amount of time it took to come to the original decision necessarily but the decision was as wrong as the eventual u-turn was inevitable.
Based on what the Athletic have reported, United’s evidence about what happened was what’s already available and what Mason Greenwood said. There was no access to the victim but there was access to her mother. They didn’t confirm or deny what Greenwood said. So at this point we can probably accept that the club couldn’t find legal grounds to terminate his contract. Fair enough. To come to the conclusion that there wasn’t enough evidence to conclude that he did what he was accused of is probably also fair. But to public declare that he didn’t commit the offences he was accused of and charged with is transparently disingenuous. Yes, the victim may not have backed up her original story but remember: this is a domestic abuse case and Greenwood was originally charged with controlling and coercive behaviour.
It would surprise me not one bit to find that Richard Arnold expected the press to find out about his plan to reintegrate Greenwood just to test the reaction. Whether or not this was intentional the end result is that United look incompetent and incapable of making, what for most people, was an obvious decision. Furthermore United look panicky, and as always slaves to the ever-changing whims of social media.
United have also managed to come out of it looking unsympathetic to charities, calling domestic abuse charities “hostile”. I appreciate people can be overly precious about words and terminology sometimes but this is not that. That’s just insensitive from United, and painfully stupid.
And just to add to the bungled nature of all this, the statement leaves open the prospect of Greenwood returning to United. Here’s some evidence for you that again, money played an enormous part in the decision making process. There’s no mutual termination of his contract. United are working to help him find another club, presumably on loan with a buy option. Clarification from United merely states that he is “not expected” to play for the club again.
This is an omnishambles from United. I think Arnold’s long-term future at the club is looking pretty precarious – as long as the takeover eventually happens. He could redeem himself slightly by putting in place a policy where these things could be dealt with swiftly in the future. Allegations and police action should bring a suspension and investigation by the club regardless of the outcome with a known outcome in the event the club finds against the player. This would serve the club well if another player faces the same allegations, especially where the evidence is put in the public domain. They might need this sooner rather than later if certain rumours are to be believed.
And whilst attitudes may have changed in the past 25 years, there remains a problem. There are a number of allegations of abuse by footballers that surface regularly. Some of these are settled out of court. Often, injunctions are put in place to stop the players identity being revealed. We sort of know the names of some players who almost certainly have committed crimes and in some cases admitted it to their lawyers. But they still go onto have glittering careers. Sometimes the most glittering careers possible.
It’s a society-wide, global problem but it seems that if you’re good at kicking a ball around you can pretty much do what you want and keep kicking that ball around.
So we’ll done United for not letting Greenwood back in. But Christ you’ve got some work to do to redeem yourselves.
Ash (but that’s United post-Fergie) Metcalfe
…Righto!!!!! ….. the Greenwood saga is all but over now barring the furore over the decision but whatever the decision was going to be it would have had supporters and detractors, but it is what it is, and United have eventually made IMHO the correct decision.
It was pretty shameful though that it was a whole load of online backlash that led to the decision, and the fact that they considered letting him come back into the fold was pretty despicable. The fact really is, that this was absolutely nothing to do with football really, other than the fact that it was over a footballer. It was all more about human decency and the powers that be at United show that they actually only possess the same amount of that as Greenwood actually does.
I was prepared to actually also walk away from supporting United after many years of doing so over this issue and I still have no high regard for the powers that be since if nobody kicked up a fuss they would have just let this arrogant thug just waltz back in and continue with his toxic behavior in the dressing room even though he may put a hold on it in his private life which will now be under a microscope. I still think that United have not come out of this smelling of Lavender fumes or roses but the stench emanating from the boardroom at Old Trafford despite their final decision is more like a toilet after my last bout of Diarrhea.
I totally blame the Glazers and their puppet Richard Arnold for this pathetic state, and if these idiots do not sell the club and walk away (I truly don’t care who to, as long as it doesn’t involve the Glazers holding any shares or continued participation in any decision regarding the club because those guys really are only as clever as your average 5 year old) I’m going to basically still end my association with the club ….. and while one person against them won’t harm them, imagine if thousands more are in the same boat as me …. this nonsense from the club is surely going to make those fence sitters minds up for them that the useless buffoons in charge over in the United boardroom are total circus clowns after all.
Nitin
…How shameful it is to be a Man United fan at the moment. To think, not only has it taken United a ridiculously long time to announce that Mason Greenwood will be moving on, but then to protest his innocence as well, whilst at the same time offering support to his victim.
I used to love this club, but those in charge just turn my stomach now.
Greenwood, Glazers, Arnold – just all go!
Suresh (York)
Mason Greenwood: Not cleared of all charges
There’s no point in going over this again, you’re either fine with alleged rape and physical abuse by footballers or you aren’t.
I’d just like to make it clear that Greenwood’s statement that ‘in February I was cleared of all charges’ is cynically disingenuous, and about as clear an example of his utter lack of remorse as its possible to get.
Domestic abusers don’t stop abusing.
On average, victims of domestic abuse return to their abusive partners seven times before finally escaping.
These are facts, and personally I would be horrified if Greenwood were ever considered as a signing for Fulham.
He wouldn’t be, though.
Tim Sutton (Mitro. Why. Oh God why)
Mason Greenwood: The defence
Now that Mason Greenwood will no longer play for Manchester United I hope the ‘Saints’ can now stop calling for his head. Hopefully nobody will wake up tomorrow and complain about the judicial system. For everyone that called for Mason’s head even after those in the know meticulously investigated and concluded that the young man did nothing worthy of conviction, I hope you finally found peace.
It’s disgustingly amusing that people watched few seconds of a relationship that’s lasted years prior to the event and even have a child together after the video and feel they have enough information to crucify, cancel and burn the man.
Benjamin Mendy missed out on a treble because he was falsely accused, this people kept quiet and said absolutely nothing about what should be done to the accusers. Was it a period of indiscretion from what we saw in the video? Yes. Was that all there was to it? No. Was that enough to make an informed conclusion? No. It is well.
Femi (Hopefully, our players will snap out of the preseason hangover), Ogun state
…So Ian Watson jumped the gun with some rant about United selling themselves out and other judgemental crap. Colour me shocked.
Turns out the club followed due process as any organisation should, involved those they should and came to a fair conclusion.
And in spite of the talent of the player, have decided the spotlight of United – not to mention constant abuse from the likes of Ian and the classic toxicity of football fans in this country, for the audacity of not being found guilty of any crime – is not the place for Greenwood or his partner to rebuild his career and their lives. It’s a shame but I get it, it’s the right decision.
What’s the most galling is people like Ian and that Countdown woman will think they somehow won or helped. You didn’t, you judged on partial information, jumped on a tiny moral high horse, and deserve the same to happen to you.
So maybe this is a good time to remind people that just because you see something doesn’t mean you have the full information or context. Do better.
Badwolf
The state of play at Man Utd
Following the performance against Wolves, I wasn’t too surprised to see United drop points against Spurs in the 2-0 loss, in which the first goal we conceded was pretty appalling from a defending point of view.
Is there cause for concern and right for the fans to react in the manner they have so far? Yes, to an extent, but it’s two games into the season. United lost their first two league games last season quite badly, particularly the 4-0 defeat to Brentford, but they did bounce back very well and were fairly decent until the start of March last year, but you can see the players and staff are making similar mistakes from the start of last season.
Against Wolves, not only did United look unfit and uncreative, but were just so bloody slow and casual on the ball, it made you think if the players were still in pre-season mode, or it was just a worrying sign of ignorance & complacency. People criticizing Mount are just daft and trolls. Yes perhaps he wasn’t the ‘Ideal’ midfielder United were looking for in being a bit more defensive, but he has plenty of experience for his age and has actually won a few ‘decent’ trophies, and maybe just needs to find his best position in that midfield (I think he would be good on the right with Dalot, Antony unfortunately isn’t offering enough going forward currently, and maybe should get dropped in a few weeks if he doesn’t improve).
Also, have to say that Bruno moaning about the referee not coming to apologise is just an example of the ignorance currently at hand. When he is missing sitters in front of goal (The rubbish header against Spurs), he shouldn’t be talking and just concentrating on improving himself and the team, but unfortunately he plays the victim better than most at the same time (Great player, but he’s not captain material).
Also, for the love of god as well, play Rashford on the f**king left and not up front. I am surprised Ten Haag is doing this, I don’t think Rashford actually knows how to play upfront on his own, or has the know how to do so and is playing there because everyone else currently known as a striker or false 9 are rubbish (Sancho & Martial). The only reason Martial is still at the club is due to his ridiculous wages. United had to sign players like Cavani and Ronaldo, at 35 & 36 respectively, because Martial was so unreliable and unfit. Honestly, one of the most disappointing signings United have made, and worst bit is, they are sticking with him as got no other options. He was twice as better in 2015 when the club signed him!
I think Hojlund will need to come back as soon as possible, and am sure will benefit players such as Rashford & Bruno, but patience needed for him to adjust given only 20 years old and don’t want him to get injured again. Stick Mount on the right or slightly further up in midfield with Bruno dropping with Casemiro, or play McTominay with Casemiro in midfield so the team aren’t done on the counter attack.
Also, I am genuinely a bit disgusted that United have not signed a defender this window. The team shipped so many goals in away games to top half teams last year, that I am surprised no action has been taken on this. Yes, players like Varane & Shaw have improved in the last year, but Martinez looks very vulnerable at times, and physically United just aren’t a strong enough team as it is. Lindelof & Varane probably have to start next game, and Martinez needs to work on his positional play, as getting exposed too much. He could maybe play as a CDM next to Casemiro, as his passing & awareness is actually very good, but is maybe just too small to play as a centre back.
Its two games in the season, but if United want to finish higher or equal to 3rd in the league following their finish last year and proceed to knockout of the Champions League, most players need to step up and Ten Haag has to make sure he motivates/trains the players in a proper fashion and work on their weak points. If the team can’t play as a team, it’s going to be another case where the 3rd season under a new manager goes tits up!
Rami, Manchester
READ: Man Utd have been poor on and off the pitch; Ten Hag must earn his beans again
Inverting inverted wingers
Tom makes a good point. Inverted wingers should all be re-inverted back to their “most natural position”. Imagine how effective Arjen Robben would have been if someone had only considered putting him on the left wing. It’s a shame that nobody close to Antony or Andros Townsend ever demonstrated the level of innovative, outside-the-box thinking required to suggest that they play on the opposite wing.
Oliver (do old men typically shout at clouds because – unlike other sentient beings – clouds won’t point out how silly their shouts are?) Dziggel, Geneva Switzerland
Navigating the midfield minefield
There has been some understandably negative comments made about how Liverpool have conducted their transfer business this summer, a lot of which I can see the logic to / empathise with – never giving the sense of a clear plan and focus on primary targets and last minute decisions that were perceived negatively by those thought to be key targets at the time. I think we can all agree that things we far smoother in years gone by in terms of getting the right people in, a point best encapsulated for me when waking up in Kyiv the day after losing to Real Madrid to see that we had signed Fabinho (no paper talk in advance / clearly part of pre-ordained plan).
Yes, it has very much not been ideal this summer, leaving me with the taste that things were a little akin to Man Utd’s transfer plans the year Moyes took charge (lacking clear plan supported by the club … all a bit of a scramble .. ending up with Felliani).
So that’s the glass half empty view … ‘Must Do Better’ on the report card in terms of approach.
Now let’s go for the glass half full view….
We have managed to bring in two highly regarded midfielders to play in the more advanced midfield positions, both at great ages – they will no doubt take a little time to bed in but for me the initial signs on those two are very positive for me (dodgy red cards aside !).
In the wake of two slightly embarrassing tug-of-wars for Caicedo and Lavia we ended up buying a 30 year old for £16m, but people should be wary of thinking that because we have spent 10% of what Chelsea have down on those two players that we are going to be 10 times worse by comparison (a throw-away line, admittedly).
Caicedo will no doubt be a success, but would he have been worth £110m of our more limited transfer funds, I’m not sure.
Re Lavia, it was relatively clear that Liverpool were uncomfortable going to £50m (yet depressingly bid above that in the hangover from the Caicedo saga). I just don’t know enough about Lavia in terms of football ability to be confident on whether we will regret how things turned out there ….. just a point though Romeo – you had your nose put out by being ‘second choice for LFC’ yet you have walked straight into a club where you were clearly second choice … and your ‘club history’ comment is a little interesting .. clearly his history books only go back 20 years and glosses over the last five from an LFC perspective (will gladly forward a lovely little chant that we sing on Chelsea away days .. you can wave your little plastic flag when listening to it).
Back to that 30 year old – have a sneaky feeling that Endo is going to turn into a bit of a cult figure at LFC. Liverpool were outworked in the middle last year and were screaming out for legs / pressing and Anfield loves a worker who sacrifices himself for the team …. it appears he has that in abundance. Passing range may not be top-end but he just needs to get the ball to the two new guys who appear pretty well stocked on that front.
… but the main reason I am ‘ok’ with what has gone on is that we need to recognise what we have coming through in Stefan Bajcetic – it’s too early to place the weight of the No6 position squarely on his shoulders but he appears to be on that path and I have high hopes. Any flower needs light in order to grow and blossom. By not capturing up either Caicedo or Lavia we have given more light in that regard for him to flourish.
I need to also mention that having a more limited depth in midfield means that we will be able to more clearly find out if Jones and Elliott are the long term future (I’m more positive about the latter).
I think Liverpool will prove to be an entertaining and at times frustrating watch this year, losing a few games along the way – can’t really see us pushing Man City that closely this year but who knows … but top 4 is an expectation more than a hope.
But let’s enjoy the ride .. it’s great to watch a team that plays with passion and positivity (isn’t it Spurs) and I for one are excited on how it will all unfold.
Sparky, LFC
Ps – Wouldn’t it be funny if the Saudi clubs rejected the idea of signing Greenwood on ethical grounds…
Eddie still not ready
I’ve written in a couple of times before stating that Eddie is not good enough to be Arsenal’s main striker.
I stand by that. He is simply not of the required standard to play for a club with title aspirations.
It’s half time against Palace so he might yet prove me wrong – I realise he scored against Forest – but I bet he doesn’t get more than 7 or 8 league goals this season. If that.
I still think Arsenal lack that final threat up front. A quality striker would love some of the chances the team creates.
And yes, I know it’s only the 2nd game of the season. Doesn’t mean I’m wrong.
Right, back to the game.
Stu (Gunner in France)
Arsenal double yellow chat
Well nobody seems to do a soft double-yellow, red card like Arsenal?
I haven’t before, or since, seen a sending off quite like Martinelli at Wolves a year or two back and now Tomiyasu gets a yellow for holding the ball for 8 seconds (Havertz had it first) and then a second yellow for a faint tug, he wasn’t even last man. The referee immediately went to his pocket, it’s almost like he couldn’t wait to get involved. When you consider that Ayew was already on a yellow right before that and quite literally threw Saka to the ground, you do wonder why always us? Ayew should have seen red if Tomiyasu is seeing red for his second offense, but just a foul is given. WHERE IS THE CONSISTENCY, Tomiyasu didn’t even get a warning.
No doubt Palace Ed will have his own view but that was piss-poor refereeing. Luckily we’re made of sterner stuff these days. Rice was immense, and to me, Havertz already offers more than peak Xhaka. Just wait till there is actual end product from him. In the interim, I’m happy with his bedding in, I love his touch and elegance, I see him being a very good signing.
I also think Palace will finish around 10th this season. Happy to get that fixture out of the way and three points was huge.
Also, well done United for eventually doing the right thing. Question is, what took so long? No doubt Greenwood will be off to Saudi now, where he’ll make millions.
Strevs, Afc, Canada
Haves and have nots
In what world does Havertz improve that Arsenal XI? Why is Arteta making problems for himself by crowbarring Havertz into his first XI, pushing Party to an inverted midfielder/ right back, putting White into CD when he was so good at RB last year? Pushing Gabriel out of the side when he’s made such a good partnership with Saliba?
Arteta really thinks he’s a genius doesn’t he. He thinks he can out-do Pep. Time will tell, but I don’t think time will be kind. Arsenal don’t have games to waste in the title chase, piecing together an entirely new formation when last seasons worked so well. Man City meanwhile carry on carrying on.
If Chelsea fans can say one ‘I told you so’ to any club it will be about Havertz.
Will (I’m amazed at how suddenly so many fans are picking up on Havertz’s weaknesses. He’s been trash for the last 3 seasons)
Brighton rock
With the final game of this weekend’s fixtures played, Brighton sit top of the league, with last season’s top two in second and third. Yes it is only two games, but is still nice to look down on everyone for a change especially having sat in 92nd for most of 1996/97 looking up. Whilst the naysayers think Brighton will be the next Southampton, my main feeling is so what. If you cannot enjoy this brilliant team then there is something wrong. Who cares that it will end one day?
Seeing Brighton achieve so much gives hope to fans of every other club out there in the football league and beyond. Many of whom will have seen their team beat Brighton this century. Each fan dreaming that one day they will have an owner that will take them into the Premier League and Europe. It has happened for Portsmouth and Hull this century, so why not us?
There is a theory that reality is just a simulation: we are in the Matrix. Well if it is, this is the simulation I’d have wanted at the club’s lowest ebb. My football team is truly living the dream I’ve had ever since I started supporting them.
Add to the fact that the club has made a profit doing this makes the whole dream even more implausible. Since 2020 Brighton have sold a squad full of talented players for over £400m, a first 11 (£377m worth) would look like this:
Goalkeeper: Robert Sanchez (£25m)
Right back: Ben White (£50m)
Left back: Marc Cucurella (£62m)
Centre back: Dan Burn (£12m)
Centre back: Shane Duffy (£1m)
Right midfield: Anthony Knockaert (£13m)
Centre midfield: Alexis Mac Allister (£35m)
Centre midfield: Moises Caicedo (£115m)
Centre midfield: Yves Bissouma (£28m)
Left midfield: Leo Trossard (£21m)
Striker: Neal Maupay (£15m)
All 11 were successful at Brighton and I’m sure De Zerbi would have turned Maupay into Gerd Muller if he’d stayed last season. This is a serious amount of talent to lose. Trossard scored for Arsenal to help win the Charity Shield and it looks like Spurs have finally unlocked the real Bissouma. I hope Chelsea afford Sanchez and Caicedo more time than they have Cucurella as all three players were exceptional for Brighton but now carry a target and weight of expectation that didn’t exist at Brighton.
The fact that Brighton still have the quality of team to beat two Premier League rivals is astonishing, especially as we couldn’t score against Norwich two seasons ago at the end of a run of six games without a win. This shows just how far the club has come in a short space of time, despite the superstars who have left. I’m really hoping Neo doesn’t unplug me from the Matrix yet. I want to see how this plays out.
David Williams
